So the question on the table is:What does it mean to be a worshipper?
Jesus said over in John 4 that God is seeking worshippers. I've heard people bandy with the phrase "in spirit and in truth". But what does it mean to worship?
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Here's a complicated definition of worship: 1) The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object. 2) The ceremonies, prayers, or other religious forms by which this love is expressed..
Here's a simple one: to serve.
We will wrestle with Jesus' phrase until we get to ask Him what He meant face to face. And that's great. He didn't take the time while He was here to spell out the 'forms' that our worship should take.
But He did talk a lot about serving. And the 'in spirit' part seems to say something about where the signs of a worshipper will be seen. In that day, it won't be measured by location (on this mountain or in Jerusalem), by posture, by the words spoken, by the building, or by any other observable factor. It's more mysterious than that.
"Where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them." That's pretty mysterious.
Whoa! I just clicked on the Martin Luther King Day button on Google to see what they had to say about our holiday, and here's what the page said:
“Everybody can be great, because everybody can serve.”
– Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
Sweet. If I do my math correctly, you plus me makes two.
That is enough.
So, is serving God worship or is serving man worship? If you serve a man, are you worshipping him? Should you?
What about these two statements?
I worship you.
I die for you.
I do remember Jesus saying, "The Son of Man came not to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many."
Was this his way of worshipping God? of serving God?
I also remember Him saying, "Inasmuch as y'all have done it unto one of the least of these my brothers, y'all have done it unto me."
"Inasmuch as y'all have done it unto one of the least of these my brothers, y'all have done it unto me."
Ah, the beautiful mystery of that statement. One day we'll say, "When did I ever give you water to drink? I don't really remember that." And He'll say, "Remember that day when you..." And our eyes will be opened.
This is exactly where the notion comes from that there are many, many things that please God, beyond doing whatever institutional Christianity and your Aunt Millie prescribe. Beyond deciding what the best form of worship is, or thinking of what to say to God, or anything conscious at all.
"So, is serving God worship or is serving man worship?" I would ask it this way, "is serving man the same as serving God?"
And I would answer, yes.
Jesus served the Father by being born, dying, and rising again, and after that, he took the throne to be served. Now we serve Him in much the same manner. We were born, we died, have been raised to life; and after this period of service, we will take our place in the future kingdom.
But as you say, the death comes somewhere in the middle. Jesus didn't come just to die. That came in the glorious middle.
By the way, 'corporate worship' does not fit into any story I can think of right now. Jesus doesn't take up His place in that image.
Which is another way of saying, I don't think it's where the Truth of in spirit and in truth is to be found.
But I may be biased against it because of all the the 'forms' of it that I have rejected.
Corporate worship. I was at a...what would I call it?...a big praise and worship music event the other night. It was cool. They had a band and these overhead projectors with the words to the song with smooth video behind it. Lots of people singing and dancing in the aisles. There was a time for everyone who came expecting a touch from the Lord to be prayed for by those around them. This is the aspect of corporate worship that I like. My kids were all really into it, too. And it was that familiar contemporary Christian charismatic style, from the type of music to the content of the message to the cadence of the speech.
Right in the middle of it, when the guy was talking about whatever...maybe he was saying how you praise God even if you don't feel like it, just like you tithe if you don't feel like it...these words bubbled up from my heart: Where would Jesus be?
I wondered if Jesus would stand where I was standing, or if He would be up on the stage with a mic dressed in all black, or if he would be jumping around like the well dressed guy in the pink shirt and tie, or if he would be laying on the ground face down, or doing the thing with the flag or the banners. Then I wondered if Jesus would actually have come at all to something like this.
If the record of Jesus in the gospels is representative of Jesus' activity (I'm fully aware that it is by no means complete), then I would have a hard time imaging Christ in this setting, whether in 30 A.D. nor 2006 A.D. And this was what I consider good about corporate worship.
If I consider worship to be "serving", or if I consider worship to be "worthship" (living every moment in a way that proclaims how much God is worth) then I do imagine a plural as well as a singular form. But something about that word "corporate" gives me the creeps.
Granted, there will be 'plural' manifestations of worship. Most likely within the context of intimacy--by that I mean, shared mission, shared victory, and shared pain. In short, it's what the body does when it's together and doing anything.
I could go the rest of my days without attending another group worship service, and I'd have plenty of chances to worship with the body.
Digging in a bit.
I have found two word groups in the New Testament for worship. the first is proskuneo, which means to kiss the hand to (towards) one, in token of reverence, to kneel or fall prostrate to express respect or to plead with one superior or rank, whether high priests, God, Christ, heavenly beings, or demons.
This is what I started the question with, the words Jesus and the woman at the well in Samaria were kicking around. She asked what the right place was to go to worship at. But Jesus declared, “Woman, believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem...a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks."
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The second one is latreia which means to serve the gods or men, and used alike of slaves and freemen.
The familiar verse for this one is verse in Romans 12:1 uses this word:
Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God—this is your spiritual act of worship OR reasonable service.
They apparently had trouble figuring out exactly what the best phrase was to use there. Paul basically said this is the logical way you should serve/worship. Logical in the literal sense, meaning that this is the way it goes, this is the logikos (the following of the divine reason or plan which coordinates a changing universe).
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And another word that goes with this is diakonos, which ended up somehow in English as "deacon". It's the general word back in the day for "waiter" or "servant". (I don't EVEN want to talk about what the church did with this word!)
The passage that goes with this one is this: Jesus called them together and said, “You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their high officials exercise authority over them. Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, and whoever wants to be first must be your slave—just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” (Matthew 20:25-28)
It seems like when they used "deacon" it just meant somebody who served, and were great because they did. This word wasn't used to denote some official status until Acts 8 when the Apostles were getting overwhelmed by menial tasks such as distributing food to the poorer members of their community. Even then, it doesn't seem especially connected with worship, per se. It was just just the way Jesus wanted his followers to live in community: serve each other; make it a priority.
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Ok, one last thing. There's one verse that has both the "kiss the hand" word and the "serve" word together. This is when Jesus was led into the wilderness and tempted:
Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. "All this I will give you," he said, "if you will bow down and worship me." Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.'"
Worship and serve. Interesting it was on a mountain. The other thing of interest is what satan wanted Jesus to do for him is exactly what Paul said would happen for God when an unbeliever comes into the midst of people who are prophesying, "the secrets of his heart will be laid bare. So he will fall down and worship God, exclaiming, 'God is really among you!'" (1 Corinthians 14:25)
Whew! Back up for air. Any thoughts?
Well, I am posting this even though I feel nowhere near qualified. And am seemingly of a different mindset.
I for one LOVE corporate worship. But just the worship. I can do totally without sermons and all the other attending aspects of "church". But there is something about gathering with other believers and just pouring yourself out singing to the Father and about Him to others. I think there is something to the passage in 3; 15-17 that basically says we should get together just to praise God and as a part of that to encourage/admonish one another.
I of course am by nature a passionate, demonstrative sort so perhaps that is just my personality.
I don't personally think of worship as service, maybe I should. I see service as a reaction to one who deserves worship. Worship to me is more a demonstration of adoration with feeling. Like girls fainting when they saw the Beatles. Me screaming Hook Em Horns at the end of the Rose Bowl. (sorry Steve, couldn't resist).
Maybe I need to think more on this. But from my human small minded egotistical viewpoint if I was a God or even a rockstar I would want my worshippers to tell me how great I am. Faint in my presence, cheer when I walked in the room. Service is a completely different thing. I think, I think.
Well try this one on as yet another image and one word definition of worship. I wrote it...the datestamp on the file says October 2003. It's ok to blush.
If Jesus is the groom and the church is the bride, then how is worship imaged in the marital relationship? In sex. It is a coming together of the bride and groom in an intimate embrace, exchanging fluids, touches, looks, words, thoughts, souls. The exchange of fluids is like the flowing of spirits, mixing and joining, rising and falling like bars of music in symphony—complex to the mind, yet to the ear and the heart, simple when accepted for the beauty they are. The touch of the lovers is the strong, delivering, arresting touch of the divine, fierce yet gentle seizing his prize, and the longing touch of the delicate, daring to anoint her savior as in death, to touch his wounds, to put her hands in his side, and to caress his strong, yet frail flesh. The look of her love is seductive and juicy, comely and soft, and only for him—naked, unashamed, unafraid, and yet so, so longing to see his look of excitement, joy, pain, pleasure, satisfaction, and delight that he has in fact won her—her body, her soul, her mind, her strength, till he can no longer hold back. The words interpret the looks and touches, and go further to engage the mind in even deeper thoughts of promise, agreement, assurance, reaffirmation, expectations, and hopes, as they are carried by the wind of breath that is also felt, smelled, even tasted. Soon fluid, touch, looks, and words fall helpless into the deep abyss of their love, where thoughts are as one and groans that words cannot express engulf the rhythm of the two to produce a soul exchange—two lives becoming one. The climax is but a foretaste of glory divine, not just the feeling but the uniting, the engulfing, the understanding, the knowing, something for which good is much too feeble a word, and something so good that it can only be foretasted until the bodies have attained the full measure of their glory.
I started to write a response the other day, then got sidetracked by my habit of jumping around subjects so I stopped (despite your good analogy last time, Steve, about water coming down a mountain creates its own path...and that's okay). lol
Anyway, a couple of different thoughts on worshipping in spirit and in truth.
1) Maybe Jesus was simply stating that for true Followers the Way is a combination being led by the Spirit (Romans 8:14) and being Scripturally sound (Truth/Word).
May not be what Jesus meant, cause it was lower-case "spirit" He said, not (Holy) Spirit, so without cranking out the online concordance there's a difference in spirit in the referenced verse ("worship in spirit and...) and the Holy Ghost.
Second, and I appreciate your sharing the latreia definition, too.
I have been frustrated for months in what I perceive a lot of American Believers think is serving.
I have taken a very tough stance on this that is very black and white.
What has frustrated me is there seems to be a percentage of the Body thinking that serving God and "works" are things like making a casserole for the church potluck, picking up a piece of trash from the church parking lot and putting it in the trash, etc.
To think or to say that these are the "works" of the Body has made me think of puking.
I just can't see myself standing before God and saying "Well, You know, I made 18 desserts for the churchwide Thanksgiving meal", and then looking at His face with this stupid, naive "are You about to pat my back" look on my face.
I just don't think that is it.
I take a very staunch approach that the works we are to do are the works of resurrection power, miracles and signs, which Jesus said "these signs WILL accompany those who believe..." (Mark 16:15-20) Not "might" or "maybe", will.
Don't get me wrong, all works are not miracles, and there's a lot of works we are called to do that are unglamorous (visit the sick, feed the poor, give of our possessions, take care of widows and orphans, etc).
Then, of course, to Jon's point about serving,makes me think of "the greatest among you will be your servant" (Matt 23), which domino effect makes me think to visit the sick, take care of widows, etc above.
I just looked up the verse where Jesus said "Depart from me...". One of the times He said this was right after He commended doing for the least of the brethren in Matthew 25.
Jesus said (to those who didn't do for the least of the brethren), "depart from me, you who are cursed, into eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels".
Wow. That is leaping out at me how strong an admonishment that is, that we NOT neglect the least among us.
This makes me think of two other verses.
Tied to neglecting, we are strongly admonished not to show favoritism in Romans, Ephesians, Colossians, 1 Tim, James.
When the verse about not doing for the least of the brethren was said, Jesus said 'you who have not done so are cursed..."
That made me think of Jeremiah 17:5, a verse I heard in a sermon this week: ""Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who depends on flesh for his strength and whose heart turns away from the Lord."
That ties right into service and Jesus' admonishment to do for the least of the brethren. If our heart has turned away from the Lord (Jeremiah verse), then we will not be serving as Jesus said the greatest among us would be doing.
One who is cursed looks to his own flesh for strength (Jer verse).
Isn't that evident in the Body? So many who do works from our own initiative (not God's), and think we're doing God all these great favors, when it's not what He wanted us to do at all (Matt 7:21-23).
That's why we have to be led by the Spirit in all we do. I have a friend who is regularly in financial need. There are occasions I am prompted to help their family, but I don't do it every time.
I can't sit there and say "Lord, your word says to help so I am". No. I help when prompted. There are times the Lord has me help them, and times He has me refrain. When I'm prompted to refrain, I just take that as either it's someone else's turn to give, or this family is to endure this financial trial for the growth of their faith, reliance and clinging to God.
Does this above (helping/serving when prompted) fulfill part of what Jesus said about worship in spirit and truth? It has flavor of that. The Word (Truth) says to help those in need. We're told "as you did it unto the least of these" brings God's commendation.
Adding to Jon's list of mysterious things, why did Jesus referenc the lower-case 'spirit' when talking about how we would worship?
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